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Post by Intensity on Feb 8, 2008 15:47:39 GMT -5
In my opinion, when combined with quality of execution, failure at every working set is not dangerous. I would even say that it's a very efficient way to train (Just periodize your training volume). By quality of execution I mean using weight you can totaly control and safely handle every rep, not using too much momentem, etc.
As far as HIT, there is some part of it I like, but I prefer a patern which allows more periodization. High/low volume, High/low rep range, Long/short rest period, etc.
Mo
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Post by mrky03 on Feb 8, 2008 16:54:35 GMT -5
I just got caught up on this thread, I used to be a Mentzer deciple! I believe his early training, the workouts he actually used to win Mr. Universe had lots of merit but the training routines he was advocating in his last series of books are totally off the wall! I actually tried his very brief infrequent training that his last book recommends. Let me tell you this is not enough training or frequency for anyone who wants to gain muscle or improve strength!
Like I said I followed his original Heavy Duty training with much success. Don't get me wrong I believe Mike contributed a lot to bodybuilding, he just got carried away with the infrequency and just how brief training should be!
I personally do about 6-8 sets per body part done to positive failure training each bodypart an average of once a week.
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Post by RUBICON19 on Feb 8, 2008 22:01:00 GMT -5
I just got caught up on this thread, I used to be a Mentzer deciple! I believe his early training, the workouts he actually used to win Mr. Universe had lots of merit but the training routines he was advocating in his last series of books are totally off the wall! I actually tried his very brief infrequent training that his last book recommends. Let me tell you this is not enough training or frequency for anyone who wants to gain muscle or improve strength! Like I said I followed his original Heavy Duty training with much success. Don't get me wrong I believe Mike contributed a lot to bodybuilding, he just got carried away with the infrequency and just how brief training should be! I personally do about 6-8 sets per body part done to positive failure training each bodypart an average of once a week. YES!
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Post by vindog on Feb 13, 2008 12:40:01 GMT -5
We see the benefit of both types and philosophies of training.With some of my clients,I alternate HIT with more Volume.I really seems to work!!!
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Post by beckie on Feb 13, 2008 22:59:09 GMT -5
Everyone I train seems to be different-some can take more HIT ie volume but others,including myself burn out fast. I think a good way to integrate it into a training regime is through periodization.
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Post by intenceman on Mar 4, 2008 13:42:37 GMT -5
I just got caught up on this thread, I used to be a Mentzer deciple! I believe his early training, the workouts he actually used to win Mr. Universe had lots of merit but the training routines he was advocating in his last series of books are totally off the wall! I actually tried his very brief infrequent training that his last book recommends. Let me tell you this is not enough training or frequency for anyone who wants to gain muscle or improve strength! Like I said I followed his original Heavy Duty training with much success. Don't get me wrong I believe Mike contributed a lot to bodybuilding, he just got carried away with the infrequency and just how brief training should be! I personally do about 6-8 sets per body part done to positive failure training each bodypart an average of once a week. Im late to this discussion, but I agree basically with this. I have tried different routines throughout my training career, mostly early on. My best gains have come through folowing routines structured like Mikes mid 70's- early 80's routines, training 3 days a week on average. This past week, I actually GAINED 3 lbs- from 248.5 lbs to 251.5 lbs, despite being on a strict precontest, high protein, med low carb , med low fat diet. I, and others, noted an increase in muscle mass and thickness, while also becoming more defined and vascular. The key was the intensity I put forth in the gym, followed by sufficient REST, and a good diet. I was also doing 2 hours 15 mins of cardio a week during that training week. I am bumping up the cardio week by week as I see fit, as I have 20 weeks til my next show and I know that "conditioning" is a major key at that level, but I wil continue to weight train in HIT/Heavy Duty. etc style. I call my version Tri- level training, as I work the posititve, static and even negative failure levels on various sets. Its a fun, interesting, and even therapeutic way to train! James
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Post by RUBICON19 on Mar 4, 2008 13:51:37 GMT -5
I just got caught up on this thread, I used to be a Mentzer deciple! I believe his early training, the workouts he actually used to win Mr. Universe had lots of merit but the training routines he was advocating in his last series of books are totally off the wall! I actually tried his very brief infrequent training that his last book recommends. Let me tell you this is not enough training or frequency for anyone who wants to gain muscle or improve strength! Like I said I followed his original Heavy Duty training with much success. Don't get me wrong I believe Mike contributed a lot to bodybuilding, he just got carried away with the infrequency and just how brief training should be! I personally do about 6-8 sets per body part done to positive failure training each bodypart an average of once a week. Im late to this discussion, but I agree basically with this. I have tried different routines throughout my training career, mostly early on. My best gains have come through folowing routines structured like Mikes mid 70's- early 80's routines, training 3 days a week on average. This past week, I actually GAINED 3 lbs- from 248.5 lbs to 251.5 lbs, despite being on a strict precontest, high protein, med low carb , med low fat diet. I, and others, noted an increase in muscle mass and thickness, while also becoming more defined and vascular. The key was the intensity I put forth in the gym, followed by sufficient REST, and a good diet. I was also doing 2 hours 15 mins of cardio a week during that training week. I am bumping up the cardio week by week as I see fit, as I have 20 weeks til my next show and I know that "conditioning" is a major key at that level, but I wil continue to weight train in HIT/Heavy Duty. etc style. I call my version Tri- level training, as I work the posititve, static and even negative failure levels on various sets. Its a fun, interesting, and even therapeutic way to train! James Nice!
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Post by Tim Wescott on Mar 4, 2008 17:08:43 GMT -5
Three sets to failure is my warmup!! Training once a year is what I think Mentzer would have advocated if he was still here. I think HIT has its place,just not in my workouts!
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Post by masterschamp on Mar 6, 2008 12:35:03 GMT -5
I never believed that you CAN'T train with both high volume AND high intensity.......I have tried everything and without a doubt it is what works best for me. I learned from John DeFendis........30-50 sets a bodypart with big weight, and I defy anyone to train with him and say it wasn't high intensity. Coleman trained that way, Cutler does a good amount of volume as well. Eric (Brugh) trains with a good amount of volume too...I trained with him and I can guarantee you it is high intensity! The real key is that everyone has varying recuperative capabilities. Train the way that allows you to recuperate best. For some, like me, recuperation is not a problem with greater volume or frequency for that matter. It's what works for ME...that's why I do it. You'll never hear me say the way anyone else trains is wrong...if it works for them, more power to them!
Keith
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Post by mrky03 on Mar 6, 2008 20:34:41 GMT -5
Good point Keith, I've always believed that individual recovery ability is one of the most important aspects of determining how to proceed with one's training. I think having a superior recovery ability is probably one of the biggest assets that sets the great bodybuilders from the rest of us mortals!
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