what happened between the 90's and now?

[1705total]

I was doing cardio the other day, and decided to watch the 1996 IFBB English Grand prix.

I was amazed to see how in shape all the compatitors were. Baker, Cormier, COleman, Nasser, Yates, Dawudo, Taylor, Leverone ect

All looked awesome and ripped. With the exception of Fux there was no distension either.

Now in my opinion the "class" of the 90's were genetically superior to the guys today.

Not just a few athletes but all the athletes. Guys like Clairmont, and Dillet, along with the above mentioned would be successfull today if they entered in that shape.

I mean not to slight todays pros, but it seems if the gene pool has slipped a little.

Guys today are not as ripped and shredded as those guys were either.

Today we see certain bodyparts ripped but not everything.
We may see cross striated thighs but not triceps.

with the exception of a few guys competing today, I see a lot of blurred muscles.

At the ironaman (as an example) Titus' legs were peeled, but his delts looked watery?

Dexter jackson can looke super peeled in the upper body, but lacks thigh seperation.

Troy Alves holds water all over his back and lower body.

But back in the 90's if you were ripped you were ripped all over.

Is there something that the guys of today are doing differently?

Or is it genetics?

[Ken B.]

I think the short answer is that new drugs came into vouge in the 90's GH, insulin, synthol, I'm sure there are more. While they were beginning to show their hideous results in the 90's among a few they were not YET being abused on a large scale as they are now where you see more Frankenstiens (and I DONT mean that in a good way) than you did in the 90s.

[Tim Wescott]

I agree with Ken,100% !!

You just do not see the same muscle density ,cuts,and definition as you previously did before the overuse of the above said items!!

Something went wrong somewhere along the line BIGTIME !

[1705total]

Thats my point exactly! Its almost as if the new "supps" not only obscurred the current pros but also made average bodybuilders better.
No offense to the following but
Kamali, Titus, Anthony, along with many others would not have stood a chance in the mid 90's.

But I do think if guys like Martinez, Charles and others might have balanced out the mass craze so to speak.

[Leviathan]

Current proceedures for precontest revolve around heavy us of drugs. In the 80's and early 90's we used to say "IF the skin on your lower back is as thin as the skin on the back of your hand, you are as ripped as you can get". Current precontest proceedures are so amazingly complex with the host of drugs, anti-this and that, hormone stopping/starting, that you seriously need an f-ing degree in chemical science to get it done.

And a new set of organs when you are done.

As I fondly remember, sodium loading and depleting was "far out there" as far as science went, and yes, we used diuretics to strip out some of the water, but usually only as a drastic last resort. Now, it's par for the course.

Drugs and the extremism we are currently seeing is killing bodybuilding. No one has any clue what really works any more except for the drugs and their various stacks.

[youngblood]

I think it's the newer drugs- GH, Insulin, and possibly the IGF-1 (I say possibly cause I've heard differing stories as to wether it actually is used/works or not) and so forth- but another thing that I think it is, is the time when the drug usage is started.
Back in the 90's guys would probably train for a certain amount of time before they used any supps. Then when they did use, their physique became more finished and refined. Whereas today, guys like Kamali (especially him, but also Kalbach, Fedorov, and all the "new biggest things") probably starting injecting after they were able to bench 225 for a max single. So they rely on the drugs, and their natural physique never got a chance to grow or refine itself. The drugs just took over- I guess a way to make an analogy is to say synthol makes a bodypart look watery, because it's not muscle at all. The drugs inflate the muscle, but there is no maturity because as soon as that guy goes off, his body wants to revert right back to its 160lb self. Case in point- Tom Prince. I don't care what TP says about his current weight, there is no way he's 255. Maybe 215 I'll believe.
Anyway, any of that make sense to y'all?

[EBA84]

I believe insulin and GH are the culprits. More so being the insulin.

[PassionateBB]

I believe it's the drugs but also the lack of muscle maturity on some of these competitors. They haven't put in the time, so they put in the drugs. There is a big difference in a physique that has been trained for many years as opposed to one only a few years. In the 80s and 90s, alot of those guys had been training and competing for years.

[ChrisC]

I think there are still plenty of bodybuilders with fantastic conditioning, the problem is they are not rewarded by the judges particulary at the Olympia. Look at someone like Darrem Charles. Conditioning wise, he can stand next to just about any comparison from today or the 90s or 80s. But , his type of physique isn't rewarded at the Olympia.

When making comparisons of the conditioning between today and 94 or some other year, an important difference is that today's competitiors are much heavier than those earlier competitors. Sure Dorian had better conditioing than Gunter or Jay Cutler, but Jay competes at 15lbs heavier and Gunter is 25lbs heavier. You can have the size or conditioning, but to improve one you will likely have to sacrifice something of the other. Cutler can come in very conditioned, but to do so he has to compete at a much lighter weight (i.e. 04 Arnold). Likewise, if Darrem Charles wanted to compete at 260, he would undoubtedly have to sacrifice some of his conditioing. I know guys like Titus are used as sort of the poster child of pros who don't quite have the conditioing, but take a look at a pic of Titus around when he turned pro - his conditioning was unbelievable. Of course he also competed at around 225 not his current heavier weight.

Yeah the use of more advanced supplementation probably has resulted in pros having worse conditioing but that is a side effect of the other effect that advanced supplementation has - much bigger size.

While judges continue to reward the bigger physiques, it's unrealistic to expect super conditioing. The day the judges start rewarding conditiioning over size is the day that the atheletes can stop playing the size game and focus on conditioning.

Well after writing all that I realize that it doesn't really add much to the question initially posed by 1400. sorry for going of on a tangent

[TLM]

No, Chris C, that's not off track, that's the entire point. The judges reward the mass freaks and something's gotta give. There are guys out there with beautiful physiques and conditioning, but its not rewarded. If you want to even have a shot at the Olympia you use what everyone else is using. Where bodybuilding is at today is a result of what's been rewarded over the years. It's fixable, but will it ever be fixed?

[ChrisC]

TLM, guess there was a point to my rambling afterall

It would be great to be able ask an IFBB judge exactly what they are looking for in competitors. It's not like bodybuilding is the only subjective sport out there, but it seems that other sports have their s*** together when it comes to judging. Take gymnastics at the olympics this summer. There are occasionally funky decisions but on average, the commentators are able to pretty accurately guess the judges scores so their is a fairly consistent standard that everyone uses and understands. I just don't see why this isn't possible with bodybuilding.

[GerryT]

Darrem Charles is old school and a throwback to the 80 s and 90s. Whether rewarded or not (and Darrem has won a few shows), he sticks to what works for him and I respect him for that.

Saw a vid of this year's Southern States where Darrem guest posed and he was in great shape and posed tremendously. He pays attention to details and truly exemplifies what the sport should be about.

[1705total]

I aggree Gerry, in fact its taken a long time but Darrem has made me a fan. He has a classicaly proportioned body.
But here in lies the problem. Can Darrem sell tickets?
Our sport will never be super big (i.e. football, basketball ect). It will always have a cult like following. Some will rally towards the physiques of the "Davids" and others will rally towards the "Goliaths."
People want to see extrodinary things. So mass will always be a cult favorite and more of a money maker.
But I do think whatever guys are doing now (in the form of chemicals) is both shortening their career, and diminishing the quality of their physique.

[GerryT]

Super post, Steve. This is not a mainstream sport and most fans want to see huge mass. But don't think that most people in and out of the sport aspire to such a look themselves.

The sport seems to have gone in cycles. Guys like Zane and Dickerson were Mr Olympia before Lee Haney and size took over. Hoping the athletes themselves will come to their senses and say enough is enough.

The fact that Darrem, Dexter and Melvin have won some shows is a good sign. And I'm hoping Mark Dugdale will open more eyes with his flawless conditioning as he embarks on his pro career.

Only time will tell.